Whether you admit it or not, being raised in America, we all know the racial stereotypes that have traversed through our colorful history. For Asian Americans, we are all good at math right? It’s a stereotype, but a good stereotype right? Despite my frequent ramblings, political correctness concerns me little. Instead, I am interested in the roots and explanations to social phenomenon that we humans, out of ignorance, simplify with racial stereotypes.
What do people really think about the Asians-good-at-math stereotype? Oh, I know, it’s because they’re smarter. Well, no, if we accept Asians are good at math because Asians are smarter, we fall into the same whirlpool of ignorance the Conquistadors used to justify their dominance over Meso-Americans or 19th century American slave owners who believed African slaves could only become civilized through hard work. Fortunately, Malcolm Gladwell’s most recent book, Outliers, has shed some light on the Asian math stereotype.
First, what we know. American grade school students have always trailed continental Asia in math. Some claim Asian students are better because they spend more hours in school. But comparing school systems fails to account for Asian-American success. Asians in America go through the same education system yet in the 2003 SAT exam, Asian-Americans averaged 575 in Math while White’s averaged 534, American Indian’s 482, Hispanics 464, and African Americans at 426.
So if it’s not the schools, what accounts for Asians succeeding in math across different education systems? As English speakers, we may be unaware, but the English language is perhaps the most odd and irrational language around. Particularly with numbers, in English, after ten the teens each have an unique name and each tenth following that gets their own name. In fact, one would need to learn 28 unique words to count up to 100 in English while in any Chinese dialect, Japanese, or Korean, one only needs to learn 11 – one through ten and one hundred.
In Asian languages like Chinese, numbers after ten follow a precise logic. Eleven in Mandarin is shi yi or ten-one, twelve is ten-two, thirteen is ten-three, and so forth. When we get to fifty-nine, the logic continues, five-ten-nine. Five tens and a nine, 59. The internal logic in counting numbers with Asian languages results in kids who speak Asian languages are able to count beyond a hundred before English speakers can even count to 40. But the Asian language advantage doesn’t stop in counting. Remember those dreaded fractions? In English we would read 3/4 as three-fourths. But for languages like Chinese, 3/4 is literally translated, “out of 4 parts, take 3″.
When you think how much more sense math makes for Asian-language speakers and considering how many frustrated 3rd graders go home with there hands crossed because multiplication doesn’t make sense. How much fun would math had been if it did make sense? Wouldn’t you do more homework? In turn wouldn’t you pick up new concepts – in which case math heavily depends on learning piece by piece – easier. Quite simply,
The much-storied disenchantment with mathematics among western children starts in the third and fourth grade, [...] perhaps a part of that disenchantment is due to the fact that math doesn’t seem to make sense; its linguistic structure is clumsy; its basic rules seem arbitrary and complicated.
Asian children, by contrast, don’t face nearly that same sense of bafflement. They can hold more numbers in their head, and do calculations faster, and the way fractions are expressed in their language corresponds exactly to the way a fraction actually is—and maybe that makes them a little more likely to enjoy math, and maybe because they enjoy math a little more they try a little harder and take more math classes and are more willing to do their homework, and on and on, in a kind of virtuous circle.
When it comes to math, in other words, Asians have built-in advantage. . .
And as a child, you’re not discouraged at math, it’s likely you’ll continue to take math classes growing up and continuing to do homework because it just all makes sense.
While extensive study on languages affect on math, Gladwell’s assertions shed light away from simplistic racial explanations for which I personally rejoice over.
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I’m Chinese.The math problems in the photo are very easy for Chinese kids. Even kids in kindergarten, they can also do that right and quickly.Because we practice a lot.
This is theory is rediculous. To count anything in Japanese, you must know about 56,000 different words because the word for 15 is different depending on whether it is 15 rabits, 15 birds, 15 people, 15 robots, etc. English is a lot easier.
Being good at math has more to do with practice than genetics (I’m an Asian mom). In general, most Asian parents value good grades. As such, they take the time to explain math concepts to their children…and then going above and beyond by pulling other sources for them to get the practice needed to secure the understanding.
Ok, so asians do well because their math is easier to read.
But if our math is harder to read, then we must work harder to learn it. Most people quit, but those who don’t will study more than asians.
So:
americans = worse average, more geniuses
asians = better average, less geniuses
african-americans = cultural heritage
I believe it’s all based on evolutionairy differences. I have a alot of asian friends who do not speak a single word from their own birth country. Most of them however are rather good at math, better than the average white person. I’ve met them all either in High School or University.
And how do you explain the fact that african-americans have a much lower score than whites? They both talk english right? I’m not saying that black people are naturally more dumb than white people but perhaps they’re just less good at maths? Or the average black person gets worse education than the average white person in the US.
there are both strong and weak arguments at play here, regarding the article and the forum. yes, chinese are better in math for several reasons: for one thing, there’s over a billion of them. statistically speaking, the law of large numbers dictates that the more of anything you have, the more chances there are for certain outcomes to occur. more people means more math students, piano prodigies, olympic team members and geniuses. at the same time, more people also means more average to mediocre outcomes, more prostitutes, more poverty, etc. the chinese that come to 1st world countries are generally from the wealthier strata. parents are often doctors, nurses or entrepreneurs looking to do better in richer countries. professionalism and a high level of prowess at something, whether verbal, quantitative or creative, tends to run in families. rich kids generally come from rich families, poor kids from poor families, etc. successful businesses tend to run in families and are passed on to kids and grandkids. children are influenced by their environment. their futures are molded within the first 8-10 years of life. perhaps there is a cultural factor here as well. asians don’t like losing face. they are group oriented. they care what other people think. social development is on kinship and communal factors and not as much on the individual. thus, they strive harder to do well in school and be financially successful in order to maintain a high status in their clans and communities. black culture is different than white or chinese. there’s no disputing that. i don’t believe the issue is eugenic or hereditary. chinese don’t have a math gene that’s superior to whites. on another level, while chinese score high on math exams, they generally don’t do as well in subjects involving free thinking. they are generally not a contemplative or philosophical people when compared to their white or black counterparts. they do well on multiple choice and standardized tests more than on essay exams. they are not as musically or artistically creative because those are not practical, money-making disciplines. math is very black and white. it’s right or wrong. there’s little room for grey area. chinese are good at this because they are a practical people and their mode of language and thinking is very clear and precise. thus, math fits in well with that. they’re just as average to mediocre in a lot of other things, like the rest of us. for every smart chinese or asian generally, i am sure that back in their home countries there are 100 average to mediocre ones.
Very interesting post. My friend a teacher postulated that Chinese are goods at maths due to their script which is geomatrically precise.
Relating back to my own experiences I have another theory. At least in India I know there was a traditional way of teaching maths which involved using social situations such as two groups of birds talking to each other and trading birds. That’s how I got taught by my grandpa and in my mental calculation I use three Indian languages. Calculations seem always see so faster in Hindi/Punjabi.
To me it’s bit like comparing Java/C/Pascal etc. Performance is all about design but there are intrinsic advantages of languages.
My takeaway I realized is to teach more of Hindi numbers to my kid and ability to work numbers in mind in Hindi.
I don’t know about this theory for Asian Americans who only speak English. I’ll buy some of it for those who speak Chinese (and hello, does it work the same in Hindi?)–my mom, who is 1.5 generation Chinese American (came to the US @ age 9), only speaks some of her family’s original dialect, but she admits that she still mentally counts in Chinese.
But I think the following theory makes more sense: a majority of Asian Americans–even 3rd generation–were raised by parents with American minority immigrant values. Think about most of the Asian Americans you know who excelled in math and math-based sciences and went on to major in these subjects. Their parents often pushed and hyper-encouraged them in those directions. I don’t know a ton of parents who are like, “Oh, yeah, you can major in anything you want…if you want to go into Modern Dance or major in Studio Art, go for it, kiddo. Just do what makes you happy!!!!! ” More are like, “We didn’t work our butts off all these years for you to go make sculptures of bicycle parts or make comic books all day. That’s for white kids with rich parents! How do you think bicycle parts sculptures are going to get you a good job once you graduate?!”
Personally, I think the reason is purely based on certain values that push kids into studying extra hard in these subjects whether or not they naturally like or excel in them. Parents who grew up with hardship and learned the minority immigrant standard that only hard work will get you anywhere know that their kids will only get ahead by performing way better than white people. Lots more reasons, but the bottom line is that I think the stereotype is based on purely superficial reasons. It’s not that Asians are better at math naturally. It’s that they’ve been made to be better at math.
This article is a vastly inaccurate retelling of the reasoning by Malcolm Gladwell in his book Outlliers. Read the book instead it makes better sense.
It’s believable, but doesn’t seem to be verified or verifiable.
obviously the theory doesn’t hold, since you made the assumption that all Asian-Americans have an Asian mother tongue, which is so not the case.
Steve Sailer pretty much debunks the Gladwell argument. Psychometricians (IQ researchers) have found a big jump in North Asian IQ for visuo spatial reasoning relative to other races, other than the Ashkenazi (European) Jews. The math ability correlates exactly, and other IQ factors correalate exactly to what we see in everyday life. But, God gives and takes away. Some racial groups are blessed with high mathematical reasoning, but can be reduced in verbal reasoning, or even general intelligence..the g factor. It is unreasonable and irrational to believe we are all the same, while simultaneously believing in evolution. John Adams noted that freedom would have different outcomes based on differing abilities. He also recognized that all humans can live under the same sun in freedom, and not under the yoke of a master.
I have a 5 yr old who is way smarter verbally than I was at that age but I can see he has the same problems I did learning to count higher then 10. I notice that if I word the question differently its more understanding to him but outside the home he will not have the luxury of having it explained to him like I do . I have to explain that to him that “and” and “plus” means the same thing sometimes.
This is an interesting theory. However, I don’t think the nature of the Chinese Language has any bearing on Chinese being good at Math.
I’m Chinese and I excel at Math. BUT, I learnt how to count in English, before I learnt it in Chinese. Even till now, I still don’t know how fractions should be articulated in Chinese.
Also, my parents have never pushed me to excel in Math. They pretty much left me to do my own learning.
If there is a proper theory on why Asians tend to excel in Math, then I reckon it has to do with genetics. Otherwise, how will one explain why NOT ALL Chinese are good at Math?
My dad is good at Math, and so am I. Just like he’s good at music, and I excel in music too. I don’t see why an inclination towards Math should be viewed differently from an inclination towards music, athletic ability, or any other talent/ability that we usually attribute to genes. So, perhaps, it’s just that a larger majority of Chinese have the “Math gene”?
“… frustrated 3rd graders go home with there hands crossed …”
I’m getting really fed up with the amount of shitty grammar and bad writing in general in blogs lately.
Gladwell, a Celt-African half breed, is necessarily defective in estimating perceptions of Japanese or Chinese. Blogger and many postors err in attributing “asian” “math” skills to language and “Confucian work ethic”; since Japanese differ greatly from Chinese in institutions, history, and language. What both Chinese and Japanese have and both Celts and Africans do not is a two thousand years’ of writing; cultures that create unique writing systems produce peoples that perceive in symbols. Celts accepted writing from Rome, only after Rome had subjugated and enslaved them; and Africans accepted writing, only after Celts–like their Roman masters–had subjugated and enslaved Africans. Chinese and Japanese, then–in contrast to Africans and Celts– naturally use writing and naturally accept instruction through writing; while Gladwell’s Celt and African ancestors sensed writing as alien, imposed, and unnatural. Expect, then, Chinese and Japanese to exceed Celts and Africans now and in the future.
Simple explanantion really. It’s the parental support and expectation. My East Asian buddies were expected to study harder, even did cram classes and extra tuition. It’s the Confucian ethic at work. So naturally they do better in math. My exam results got me into advanced maths classes year after year but eventually I lost interest – and there wasn’t the same level of support and encouragement (and dare I say weight of expectation) from my parents. They were in their own way anti-intellectual – intellectuals were to be distrusted.
The language idea postulated here is bunk IMHO. It wouldn’t stand the scrutiny of evidence based study.
My mandarin is rusty, but since 10 is shi, and 1 is yi, surely 11 is shi-yi?
Their “numbering method” maybe simpler but the writing system is the opposite. Generations of Chinese learning all those logographs (word symbols) in order to become literate may have an effect on the gene pool. Possible those who acquire literacy will have an advantage over those who don’t. Is that a plausible explanation? (I am assuming here that the part of the brain that is used to learn to read is similar to the part that processes numbers.)
i just want to add that in mandarin, all numbers and mathematical terms are single syllables and many of use are forced to memorize our times tables until it became second nature. it did not hurt that our times tables are slightly poetic either.
The better at math thing is definitely sociological and not genetic as one underrepresented part of the equation is after school tutoring and cram schools where students are given 40-100, yes, i said 100, test to do over the period of one summer.
Interesting website, i have bookmarked your site for future referrence
Interesting, although to be fair that stereotype is more directed at the fact that our culture is more lax and the level of education is much less strenuous. Since the work ethic is higher we tend to make a joke out of it by saying “All Asians are smarter.”
I think its a semi-valid statement when directed at their culture and not Asians in general, irregardless of their logic.
This isn’t really a new idea. Read some stuff by Amy Tan (non-fiction preferably) and she talks, in length, about this already.
I’m not saying you’re conjecture is wrong (and I do agree with it) it’s just that you were beaten to the punch.
The fact is every qualified person who tries to do a real study to determine if precived differences in intelligence among the races are true and if so are caused by genetics is vilified as a racist. There’s no evidence to support genetic predisposition of math aptitude among Asians because no study is allowed to be done. Admitting differences is not the same as claiming superiority.
Facts and scientific discovery should not be hindered or ignored because some people want to pretend differences do not exist between races in a vain attempt to avoid racism .
Sorry to be “that guy” but “shi er” is not 11, it’s twelve.
Chinese numbers go this way: yi er san si wu liu qi ba jiu shi shi-yi shi-er etc.
Most Indian (including Hindi) languages do not map well into numbers but the kids do well in math anyway. Further, many Indian kids who can barely muster a sentence in their mother tongue do very well in math. IMHO it comes down to parental support / example / expectations.
I’m not sure this is entirely valid. Imagine an incredibly difficult language, with no redeeming features, where 3/4 translated to “Three steps forward, four steps backward” or something which really does not aid in understanding at all (mine is a poor example, but then again I’m only a stupid English speaker, so my mind isn’t very developed). There will be some for whom the idea of maths in this language is too daunting, sure, but anyone who does do so will get far more mental exercise from simple activities than other language speakers. Alzheimer’s researchers say we make our minds sharp by challenging them, surely this should confer an advantage? I’m leaning towards the difference in immigrant culture as the strongest explanation here.
As a longer than usual blog post, I may have made the actual argument a bit vague.
The idea isn’t so much, language makes math easier. Instead:
1) Compared to English, Asian languages makes learning math at young ages more intuitive.
2) Since learning math at a young age is more intuitive, Asian-American children that are fluent at their native language are LESS LIKELY to find math a frustration topic.
3) By high school/college (where American students fall behind the rest of world in math tests. Noting that American students are best in the world at math up until middle school), a larger number of Asian students, who had an easier time learning math, don’t have the same negative disposition to learning it, and then take more upper-level math classes and stick with it.
Thus, accounting for the disparity between Asian-American math scores and other American sub-groups.
4) Therefore, the theory is not so much Asian languages directly makes math easier. It’s instead, Asian languages makes learning math at a young age less frustrating and easier. As American students are commonly frustrated with math, since Asian students found an easier time learning it when they were young, Asian students are less intimidated by upper level math and therefore will study more, find the homework less tedious, enjoy math more, and ultimately leads to higher test scores.
If I could offer a somewhat related theory, or at least one that seems plausible. We think in the formats of our languages, think of it sort of like programming languages for a computer. Do english speaking countries lead in certain subjects, or German, or French? One possibility might be that the format of the language creates a certain thought process or at least pushes and optimizes the brain on certain tracks of thinking, coupled with the bakground they have from their homes.
It might be possible that the asian-american students who might not be fluent in their home language have parents or grandparents who were/are, the way that they speak to their children, teach them, and the like would still mold their childs thought process and set it on certain tracks.
The idea of language as a base is somewhat compelling, but it might also just mean that culturally Asians are a very organized and orderly people, those that have said aspects of that culture ingrained in them might have an easier time with math or other similar subjects.
Just some food for thought.
I’ve thought about this and its a combination of factors. The language bit makes young kids understand multiplicaton/division in the sense that words are actually expressed as multiplication/disvision – fine – they can add/subtract/multiply/divide. The post relating to other languages, i/e/ french, well, it makes sense- 80 in french is 4 20′s. Many of the best mathematicians are from france. But in reality, it also probably has to do with the idea of language and how their brains develop early on – there are so many words to memorize in chinse and its a complicated language – numbers come easy to that kind of early development. Kids that play instruments, or expand their mind early on are good at math and learn it quickly as they apply and understand concepts, its a matter of rationalizing expressions. Chinese that grew up in a chinese environment get math, wheras chinese who are more lazy, american-asian, i would say are slower at math… its a question of development of a mind early in life.
And I _suck_ at math.
Yeah, i’m not too sure on that native speaker take either. My wife is a native Guangdong-Wa speaker, born in Guangzo (Canton) and she and her brothers do excel at math, and are better speakers of English than most native-born Americans. But my son, who only knows a very small amount of Cantonese; (Nei Ho Ma, Do Jai, Ho Mahn, Jo Sohn, etc) excels in math. I excelled in English and grammar and have a heck of a time with him teaching this. My 2nd son is only 3 but already has a huge grasp of English and his math skills are already surprising me.
Umm… please explain to me when language stopped being considered “cultural.” ? Gladwell’s whole “theory” (I agree with other readers that this is actually more of a hypothesis than a true theory) suggests language is this mystical “make-or-break” ingredient in the recipe of math ability (at least for younger children)… I believe you have incorrectly summarized/paraphrased him in this comment of yours. Like I stated to begin with, when did language stop being “cultural”?
Sorry, the language theory cannot hold water. If so, then Hebrew and Arabic speakers would also be great at math. In Hebrew it is exactly the same as in asian languages. Everything is counted (11 is Ahad Esra, meaning 10 and 1, 15 is Hamesh esre, 10 and 5 etc… and the same for Arabic. If I am not wrong this is true for all semitic languages.) But Israel has poor scores in the last 2 decades in math (at least in the lower school grades). And this is because the education system is faulty, certainly not the genetics of people, because in the 50′s and 60′s Israel was at the top.
It is a cultural thing: immigrant kids will be better then native born (in Israel there was a huge immigration of russians and the kids are way better then Israeli born kids ). Asian societies want to be in par with the west and so they invest a lot in science and math.
Why are indian kids good at math as well then? While the language theory might account for a small part, the main difference is pressure from immigrant parents to do well at school starting at a young age. After all, they moved so their children could lead better lives than in their home country, so obviously it is imperative for them to make their children do well in school. If you take scores from second or third generation asian-americans, you will probably find that their scores are probably not much higher.
I believe shi-er is twelve in the Chinese language. Shi yi is eleven.
Out of curiosity you know that “three fourths” literally simplified means split into fourths, then take three of them. That bit of what you are saying is really a bit weak.
Also seeing as almost all maths is written, and your example up there is using the western Arabic numeral system, the importance of spoken maths seems a bit over stated.
A final extra point –
I personally believe the best explanation is cultural values in math and sciences.
I only bring up Gladwell’s position to suggest that if there is in fact a non-cultural reason, let’s not so easily accept it’s a genetic reason.
Charley :
There are certainly evolutionary differences between different groups of humans scattered across the world.
But, as I’ve made this point in the post:
Or perhaps even more recently, these same beliefs in evolutionary superiority led to the massive eugenics movement in Nazi Germany to create a “master aryan race”
With that said, let’s say we accept the position that Asians are better at math because of evolution. From centuries or millennia of genes being past down from one Asian generation to the next, some sort of geographic influence on the Asian continent sparked the transference of a gene conducive to upper-level math ability.
Note: I only refer to upper-level math because from elementary to middle school, American students of all creeds are amongst the best in the world. American students only fall short, statistically, after middle school.
The position that evolutionary traits has something to do with Asians doing well in math implies this evolutionary trait gives Asian-Americans a distinct advantage in upper-level math. If the majority of all American students do well in math up until middle school, this Asian-trait must create an advantage for upper-level math. But the question arises, where, when, and why did this trait arise and persist?
What is different about the Asian geography in millenias past that would have sparked this evolutionary trait. Is it farming and agriculture? Only recently, in the grand scheme of state evolution, has Asian nations became modern implying a shift from Agriculture. Where even then, the majority of Chinese citizenry are still farming in rural areas.
What about the Asian geography could have sparked an evolutionary gene that can explain upper-level math prowess?
Why are we so darn scared of admitting that perhaps there *are* evolutionary differences among races? There are. There is physical proof. Deal with it. There are fundamental differences in bone structure and musculature between the races – you can’t deny this. Evolutionary psychologists show us how our *behaviors* have evolved through natural selection. Does it not seem rational that we might have evolved differently in other areas as well?
This language “theory* is bunk feel-good stuff and has no merit.
Not especially relevant, but a hypothesis is an unproven assertion. A theory is like a hypothesis, but with mounds of evidence to back it up.
I’d find this “theory” more of a hypothesis myself, since it’s just attempting to reason the data we have, and it’s only considering one variable. In order to become a theory, it would have to be tested in all ways possible, not just pushed forward as the answer.
I’d like to point out that Asian families, even when they’ve lost the language, tend to do better than their counterparts. This is mostly explained by the parents who will push their children to achieve. The smart Asian kids tend to study more – two of my friends are adopted Asians, and they have perfectly normal grades and skills, even going below average every now and then. The people I know who are from Asian families, however, tend to do better. Language would certainly help (English is confusing in more ways than one), but I don’t think that it’s the only factor.
The book is written by Malcolm Gladwell. At least get basic attributes like that correct, please.
SO, on this theory, that math skills have nothing to do with Genetic endowment, only language, then My dog should be just as good as Asians, except that barking makes her inhertently unable to reason mathmatically…
Golly, the ability of naive idealists to rationalize away realith to support nonsensical ideas never ceases to amaze me
So explain to me the strong evidence you have for genetic endowment. What specific genetic endowment is explaining this Asian “prowess” at math?
David and Mr. “Not-an-Asian”,
You both raise strong points, however the points are based on faulty logic.
The intricacies in a few Asian languages MAY present an advantage. With that said, an argument dictating that one characteristic may give a person an advantage fails to imply, without that advantage, that a same person will struggle.
For instance:
Being tall may give you an advantage at basketball. But not being tall doesn’t mean you will struggle, nor does it preclude you from other traits that would give you an advantage (i.e., speed, agility, endurance, etc…)
With that said, the theory attempts to explain why a larger percentage of Asian-Americans (and we know it’s a percentage since the SAT is scored in percentiles), succeed at math.
Language is a clearly identifiable trait you can associate to specific subsets of people and, to a degree, isolate as a factor that contributes to mathematical prowess.
And sure, there are plenty of mathematical genius’ around that are not Asian (Einstein, Stephen Hawking, Steve Nash, etc…). But we are not looking at the outliers, instead we are looking to explain why Asians as a group score higher in math than other groups.
I’m not saying the theory is true, for the pure fact that theories are unproven assertions, my contention is Malcolm Glasgow’s theory presents a new and refreshed theory to explain some American social phenomenon.
Exactly. Something is terribly wrong with this theory. And there are other languages with similar number systems.
I still use my fingers and toes to count….
I checked the kid’s math in the photo. He’s right
I read about this theory in a book called “The Outliers” by Malcolm Gladwell. This makes perfect sense. That’s why I’m so smart….
I got my site up also: michaelvo.com
So following his argument, he is insinuating Asian Americans who aren’t fluent in their native language would struggle with math like every other American whose primary language is English.